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Loudmouth

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Geldof Concert in Libya 20th September 2007
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According to the Guardian newspaper he has . And caused a near riot doing it. Is this article completely ficticious? if so, then there should be a formal complaint. If it is true, they have kept it quiet.
http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/hisham_matar/2007/09/no_hope_for_change.html

I have deleted all my further posts on this subject, which I am entitled to do, as they are MY posts. If anyone reinstates them, I will just delete them again. I would like to have deleted the whole thread, but do not want to delete other people's posts. I have nothing further to say on this subject, apart from I wish I had never started this thread in the first place.

-- Edited by Scottie at 20:44, 2007-09-22

ADMIN NOTE - edited title to make more sense - Geldof did play in Libya.

-- Edited by ArrGee at 21:05, 2007-09-27

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The Dutch One

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RE: Has Bob ever played Lybia???????
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Complete rubbish if you ask me.
If you see the page that it links to (on youbloom), you'll know that it's all b***sh*t.

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CRAZY

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Oh, no...Can't be? hmm

Lets do some research guys to see if it is possible that he was in Libia this month...

Well, he was booked for Dubai earlier this year.  I don't think that concert was held. HMMMMMMMM.



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I think Bob tends to maintain a dignified silence when there is bad press.  Probably especially when it is lies.  Responding may only serve to fuel the fire and he or his management will only get misquoted or taken out of context.

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i can confirm that Bob and the Band did play in Libya



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Scottie wrote:

And they have probably regretted it ever since!
I wonder what caused the unrest.
Wonder if tony Blair had anything to do with it.?

Oh yeah, a whole month of regret.  http://theboomtownrats.blogspot.com/2007/08/i-predict-riot.html 

Probably when Geldof started playing his solo material.  The Libyans didn't think too much of it and chucked cans at the stage.  Geldof figured he'd never get away with just doing Mondays another half a dozen times (though hasn't stopped him doing it ad nauseum elsewhere), so they made a quick exit.  The Libyan people have to be commended.

Yes, Tony Blair was responsible (not for the riot, but for Geldof being there inflaming them).

Scottie wrote:
If all this did happen, then why was it not splashed around in the British Tabloids at the time?. The anti -Geldof brigade , and there are many, would have jumped on it right away. I can't see how it could have been kept quiet.


Apathy in the UK?  It did happen, but to be honest, it's not all that interesting.  Geldof turning up for a concert and not playing is only news in the same way that Pete Doherty getting off a drug rap is.
 


-- Edited by ArrGee at 21:45, 2007-09-20

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RE: Has Bob ever played Lybia???????
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Scottie wrote:

I dont think the Lybian people would be up on Rats songs anyway. 30 years ago, their access to Western music would have been limited, I suspect. We don't know the circumstances of this concert.



Libyans, not Rats fans!   The vast majority of Rats sales in Arabic countries were in Tripoli.  Most Libyans dress in pyjamas in tribute to Johnnie Fingers.

I know sarcasm doesn't work so well written down, but c'mon my analysis of the gig is as valid as their rioting when they heard The Great Song of Indifference and taking it literally this would mean the Libyan audience had a grasp of English comparable to the Dutch.

I thought the circumstances were clear.  It was a political rally. 





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Scottie wrote:

 I am going to try to find out what happened from someone who was there, if I can. Will let you know if I get any response.

"What remains difficult to understand, however, is what was Geldof doing there in the first place? Accepting an invitation to play after the dictator's son's speech suggests support of a regime that has oppressed the Libyan people for 38 years." - Hisham Matar Booker Prize shortlisted Author

That is from someone who knew people that were there, seems pretty black & white, and is what I would consider to be a reliable non-anonymous source.  There are other news items out there on this. 

This sainted Geldof is not the Geldof I know, and some of the comments on this thread imply he is.  How could Geldof have anything other than the best intentions?

Mine were tounge in cheek, yet seem to have caused an extreme reaction/discussion.  I don't see that it's so hard to comprehend that Geldof is available for hire to the highest bidder, with little thought of the consequences.

"I think Bob tends to maintain a dignified silence when there is bad press. " - Jules

The way I see it is he doesn't like critcism.  Dignified silence?  He keeps quiet and likes to try to silence people.  I know.  I've been there.

I may be a fan of Geldof, but why does that mean he has to infallible?  Surely he is due a bit of criticism from time to time. 

-- Edited by ArrGee at 21:51, 2007-09-22

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The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

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ArrGee I didn't take offence from anyone and was making a diplomatic statement, certainly not suggesting Bob is any kind of saint.  I am under no illusion about him!  wink  But sometimes I want to defend him whether it is justified or notsmile

Not sure what's gone wrong on this thread and why it has caused unpleasantness!hmm

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Jules wrote:
Not sure what's gone wrong on this thread and why it has caused unpleasantness!hmm

I don't see the unpleasantness, all I see is a disagreement.

http://www.activeboard.com/forum.spark?forumID=48603&p=3&topicID=3144054

Netiquettes - a few basic rules: (extract)


3. If you're going to make a statement, give some supporting evidence. Preferably something based on both evidence and logic, and preferably something that doesn't come from a blatantly biased source.


4. Attack IDEAS, not people.


5. When quoting another person, edit out whatever isn't directly applicable to your reply. 
Take the time to edit any quotations down to the minimum necessary to provide context for your reply.

3. The statement I made is supported by a Booker Prize shortlisted author.  He may be biased with regard to the Libyan dictatorship, but would suggest he has been objective with regards to Geldof's involvement as he has no axe to grind with him.

4. I am attacking the idea that Geldof's motivation for this gig were sound.  I just think he did it for the money.  And he doesn't care who pays for him to play as long as they stump up enough cash.

5. I'm glad I did that, though the full context of the thread is now somewhat diminished.

OK, now maybe I should have cut out the sarcasm, but the image of thousands of Libyans rioting because Geldof played the Great Song of Indifference just made me laugh, so I just made it more riduculous.  I meant that to be humourous, though it has been perceived as an affront.

Time was I could have a disagreement on this forum.  As long as there are no personal insults and people make their point, I see nothing wrong with passionate disagreement. 

I know how Richard Dawkins feels.  Not a good thing to tell people God ain't real.



-- Edited by ArrGee at 21:50, 2007-09-22

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The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

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Hey ArrGee I wasn't arguing with anyone anywhere and hadn't taken offence, but noticed that there had been some discussion about unpleasantness.  Also I noted you saw my statement and thought I was giving Bob some kind of Saint status!!  Ho ho, no!!!biggrin

Both these things were separate.  Should be careful about how I write too, maybe.  I try to put emoticons by statements but it still doesn't workhmmsmile

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You dont get it do you Arr GEE? Sarcasim IS the unpleasantness. I dont care about your anti stance. Sarcasim is a form of verbal abuse. It makes the receiver feel belittled, stupid, ridiculed, made fun of, and hurts like hell. It makes other people join in the ridicule too. Believe me, I know what I am talking about. I have been bullied a throughout my life and have discussed this with other people who have been through the same. Sarcasm is hateful and hurtful  and cruel. It NEVER, EVER works, it only makes things worse and puts people's backs up. It IS an attack on the person, not their ideas. In the past, you have called me condesending and patronising on a very public forum for all the world to see. So, I think this is the end of the road.

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RE: Has Bob ever played Libya???????
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Scottie wrote:
It IS an attack on the person, not their ideas.

Where is the attack on you?  Almost everything you post is pro-Geldof to the point of disbelief.  Look at the opening post.

"Is this article completely ficticious? if so, then there should be a formal complaint. "


Can't I write something in opposition?  The first comment I made was Geldof inflamed the audience by doing his solo stuff and all I have done since is support my opinion that Geldof did it for the money and repond to the responses to my posts.  If anything, the attacks are on him with his "dignified silence".

What have I written that is anything other than the attack on the idea that Geldof's motivation was some humanitarian cause?  I could have quite easily quoted any of the other numerous "Bob does no wrong" posts.  I chose yours as you started the thread. I think he should do things from the perspective of his head or his heart not his wallet.

I'm sorry that you have been bullied in your life. I have as well, though as you may comprehend from my scribes, I'm not the sort to take it lying down. I fail to see how a comment about Geldof inflaming an audience counts as bullying.  

I disagree with you.  I don't dislike you.  Ultimately I don't know you.  There are many times you have posted when I agree and many where I disagree (often I don't respond).  Often people disagree with me on this forum (and others), and some have been quite vociferous in the past.  

As for the end of the road, maybe you don't care for me, but you seem to have plenty of other members who share your views.  I think it would be disappointing if you were to stop posting.  You are one of the few that does post anything worth reading these days.  I apologise for causing any offence, and think you would be better of hanging around rather than taking my opinions to heart.



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The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

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Irene, please reconsider, I don't want you to go either, what can we do to persuade you?

Maybe we can all learn something - be very careful about what we write on here. Even if it isn't meant to be attacking in anyway, if it is taken that way we need to do something about it.  I suggest:

If you feel threatened/belittled (or any other negative feelings) by the actions or words of another, in anyway please say you feel that way.  Just make a plain statement about how you feel. Other person please take it seriously, even though, as I said, it wasn't meant at all in that way and perhaps try to rephrase or accept, at least and respect the other person's feelings.  As ArrGee says, we don't know each other and don't know others' sensitivities, feelings or reasons for feeling in such a way.  If you feel targeted and the other person apologises and explains also respect the other person and have your mind put at rest.

Let us not get into a never ending spiral of sniping, not explaining and not nipping it in the bud immediately. 

I too have been the target of bullies from school until a few weeks ago (and may never get away from it).  It is truly horrendous, depressing and very detrimental to self esteem.  ArrGee I admire your resiliance to it and ability to fight back.  I can't defend myself in any situation, but have just recently found a way of coping  and fighting back - I resigned from my well paid job at the end of July to go temping and study for an OU degree - in Psychology.    Scottie, don't be broken by it, fight on.  Find your own way.  One way is to stay here!smile

Let's look after each other not fight each other, please.cry

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Hi Folks,

I have EXTREME misgivings on this story for a large number of reasons:

1. Libyans never - I repeat never - have been banned from learning English. This is complete bull****. One of the paradoxes of the Libyan regime (and there are many) is that the regime is happy to let Western magazines such as "Time" and "Life" be sold in the country, and for western programmes to be available via satellite TV. There was an attempt at "Arabisation" in the 1970s, but it was a total failure, & was given up by the 1980s (Libya under Gaddafi is well known for having undergone various "fads", the one doing the rounds just now is getting to host a World Cup & growing fruit not normally associated with Libya - Gaddafi's a mega-fan of fruit it seems, particularly dates!). Libya's close ties with Malta always made it a non-starter anyway.

2. Seif is not guaranteed to be the successor to Gaddafi, who would have chucked in the job he never wanted in the first place about 20 years ago (how he came to become Libya's dictator is a tale worthy of the Marx Brothers' Duck Soup). Seif is merely the West's "preferred candidate".

Some of the clever money is on his daughter, Aisha, who is a regular visitor to the Knesset (Israel's parliament) & is Libya's preferred "Devil's Advocate" when having dealings of a potentially sensitive nature. 

3. I don't think Colonel Gaddafi would have been very happy had he known Bob was in town. It was Bob's blazing row with French MEPs on live TV in 1985 in which he accused the French of cutting a deal with Gaddafi to carve Chad in two (Libya taking the Arab half with all the Nitron & underground water, France the black half with all the oil!) that exposed to the world both sides' duplicity in the Chad civil war.

4. Far too many Libya stories in the Guardian tend to be penned by members of Libya's outlawed opposition group, the so-called National Front For The Salvation Of Libya. Sponsored by the CIA and the Saudis, their aim is to overthrow Gaddafi & establish the same sort of pro-Western dictatorship that Mubarak has in Egypt. And thereby lies the explanation why Gaddafi's never been overthrown by his own people...

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Mark - Thank you for the insightful post - Would you happen to have some links for people you'd like to learn more?

I very much would like to know the reason behind Geldof playing in such a volatile venue. Money? I doubt he's that desperate. I also doubt he went there in ignorance of the situation.

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MJ wrote:
I very much would like to know the reason behind Geldof playing in such a volatile venue. Money? I doubt he's that desperate. I also doubt he went there in ignorance of the situation.

Very unlikely the reasons will come out.  I doubt he's desparate, but he may be just plain greedy.  I wouldn't say he was fully informed  of the Libyan situation(unlike Mark Boyle; that was a very enlightening post), but surely playing a gig at a political rally in a country with the reputation of Libya would make most people think of the consequences. 

Normally, the lack of any notice of the concert on the official site would betray misgivings, but frankly I just think the site isn't updated and nothing should be read into that.

Ultimately, no reason/explanation/discussion will eminate from Geldof and his management, so we can all speculate on this.  Personally, I think he did it for the ca$h, and intended to keep quiet about it.  Had a riot not broken out, no one would ever have known. 

Who knows, Geldof may have done other concerts down the years in similarly dubious circumstances.   Wild speculation, of course, but that's what "dignified silences" lead to. (Jules, not intended as jibe at you, but given the high horse Geldof is often on, probably how he sees it).


-- Edited by ArrGee at 09:48, 2007-09-24

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Dave

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For god's sake, can't you just leave it??


ArrGee wrote:


Ultimately, no reason/explanation/discussion will eminate from Geldof and his management, so we can all speculate on this. 


Yes, and do you know why? Because it's a no win situation. Whatever they say - you'd come and walk all over it.

As far as I know the only source there is is a comment/blog entry that quotes the youbloom thing. Correct me if I'm wrong. Do we know what really happened? All your speculations are based on one single blog entry. I think that's a bit thin. Nothing against Hisham Matar, I don't know him, he seems to be a novelist but I don't know which other sources he has. Or IF there are other sources. Is there free press in Lybia? No idea. I think none of us here has the knowledge to understand the situation in Lybia.
  

ArrGee wrote:


Who knows, Geldof may have done other concerts down the years in similarly dubious circumstances.   Wild speculation, of course, but that's what "dignified silences" lead to.

"Dubious circumstances?" I think you're going clearly too far. Wild speculations indeed. For my understanding, this is libellous or at least getting close.



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Katharina wrote:

As far as I know the only source there is is a comment/blog entry that quotes the youbloom thing. Correct me if I'm wrong. Do we know what really happened? All your speculations are based on one single blog entry. I think that's a bit thin. Nothing against Hisham Matar, I don't know him, he seems to be a novelist but I don't know which other sources he has. Or IF there are other sources. Is there free press in Lybia? No idea. I think none of us here has the knowledge to understand the situation in Lybia.
  

There is also this link, and others.   I had already refered to it via another link earlier in the thread.

http://www.jeuneafrique.com/partenariat/article_jeune_afrique.asp?art_cle=LIN26087couacizahgn0&part=50



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ArrGee wrote:
There is also this link, and others.   I had already refered to it via another link earlier in the thread.

http://www.jeuneafrique.com/partenariat/article_jeune_afrique.asp?art_cle=LIN26087couacizahgn0&part=50


In fairness I have to say I overlooked that (didn't click the link). But the jeuneafrique article is in French, my French isn't very good and it seems to be mainly anti-Gaddhafi and not so much anti-Geldof.

But my point was that you make spiteful assumptions on the basis of press comments.  



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Katharina wrote:
But my point was that you make spiteful assumptions on the basis of press comments.  

What are the spiteful assumptions?

Let me clarify what I think.  Geldof took on this gig because someone offered to pay his fee.  He did not take into consideration the circumstances of this gig (i.e. a political rally) nor that it could be seen as implicit support for a succesor to Gadaffi.   I think Geldof made this decision to play based wholly on the cash on offer.

Please remember at least the first four posts (maybe more, some have gone) on this thread dismissed the possibility of him playing there at all, because Geldof is an honourable man.  I put forward the suggestion that he did it simply for the money.  Of the potential conclusions on Geldof's involvement that is possibly one of the least spiteful that could have been drawn.



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ArrGee wrote:

What are the spiteful assumptions?



Who knows, Geldof may have done other concerts down the years in similarly dubious circumstances.  


THIS is what I'm talking about. This is clearly an assumption, and it's not friendly.



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Katharina wrote:



ArrGee wrote:

What are the spiteful assumptions?



Who knows, Geldof may have done other concerts down the years in similarly dubious circumstances.  


THIS is what I'm talking about. This is clearly an assumption, and it's not friendly.



Fair enough, I retract that.  Lazy speculation on my part.



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Jules wrote:
Both these things were separate.  Should be careful about how I write too, maybe.  I try to put emoticons by statements but it still doesn't work
I saw this on facebook.....

Anyone have any Bob/Rats dedications they'd like to make. Here's one for Colonel Gaddafi... Love Julesxxx
The Boomtown Rats - Go Man Go!

Not sure Geldof will be too pleased with that, one of his big paydays is off the agenda.  He gets the magical 2000 out there.

I never realised it was so degenerative on facebook...



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Mark Boyle wrote:
... Far too many Libya stories in the Guardian tend to be penned by members of Libya's outlawed opposition group, the so-called National Front For The Salvation Of Libya. Sponsored by the CIA and the Saudis, their aim is to overthrow Gaddafi & establish the same sort of pro-Western dictatorship that Mubarak has in Egypt. And thereby lies the explanation why Gaddafi's never been overthrown by his own people...
Well that holds no water whatsoever!  Looks like the real reason he survived was divide and conquer...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/libya/8343859/Libya-protests-The-tangled-web-keeping-Gaddafi-in-power.html


They are getting shot of all the dictators right now.  The Egyptians, the Libyans, the Tunisians...


 



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ArrGee wrote:
I saw this on facebook.....

Anyone have any Bob/Rats dedications they'd like to make. Here's one for Colonel Gaddafi... Love Julesxxx
The Boomtown Rats - Go Man Go!

Not sure Geldof will be too pleased with that, one of his big paydays is off the agenda.  He gets the magical 2000 out there.

I never realised it was so degenerative on facebook...

 



That's a dedication from me not Bob, he can think how he wishesbiggrin that's how I think.

Maybe Bob will be singing another piece of dictator left my atlas today soon?

 



-- Edited by Jules on Thursday 24th of February 2011 08:23:22 AM

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Maybe the revolution in the middle east all started here.....


A couple of days after Seif al-Islam's speech and Sir Bob Geldof's attempted gig, an eyewitness account, published in the dissident news website Libya Al-Mustaqbal, stated that around 400 young men, blindfolded and handcuffed, were seen stepping off an airplane in Tripoli International Airport. The men were packed into prison trucks and driven away. The plane had come from Benghazi.

http://www.ifddesign.com/index.php  Some pictures prior to the gig taking place can be seen here.



-- Edited by ArrGee on Tuesday 1st of March 2011 11:34:05 PM

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http://www.baabamaal.tv/daccord/issue03/article4.html

The reasons why Geldof played.  Sadly his fears were justified...

 

 

Geldof confided why he was playing this Libyan show: 'I'm doing this because I want to see what's going on. They've just released the Bulgarian nurses, who they'd sentenced to death for infecting four hundreds kids in a Benghazi hospital with AIDS. Gaddafi wanted a scapegoat.' Tortured in prison since 1999, six Bulgarian health workers and a Palestinian doctor were sentenced to death in 2004. This summer, after French intervention, they were freed. 'The French had to give Gaddafi a nuclear reactor in return,' Geldof grimaced.

Saif Gaddafi had helped negotiate; the heir-apparent, he wields the knife of Libya's face-lift. 'About time,' said Geldof. 'I was in Chad once when Libyan planes flew over, chucking bombs down.' But he also revealed a secret worry: 'I hope I'm not being used as a patsy.'


... in a backstage tent shortly before his set, he revealed: 'There's been a wobbler. I was going to dedicate I Don't Like Mondays to the policewoman Yvonne Fletcher. But the translation people sussed it I thought they wouldn't know who she was.' I had to hand it to him for his bottle.

...

When Saif Gaddafi took to the stage, it signalled something like Beatlemania. For more than five minutes the number-one son stood at the front of the apron, arms slightly outstretched, beaming beatifically at his future subjects - his 'fans' screamed and cheered exaggeratedly. 'They're plants,' said Geldof. 'I was looking at the crowd on the TV monitors: no-one at the back was responding like that.'

As we stepped across the tarmac to the plane the next morning, Bob Geldof turned to me and grinned. 'The West's fookin' alright, isn't it?' he chuckled.



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Loudmouth

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So is Geldof forgiven now, seeing that he was checking out what was going on in Lybia at first hand. I doubt he is naive  enough to just turn up and take the money. 

What was the main contention anyway? That he was propping up Gadafi's regime by playing a concert?



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noelindublin wrote:

So is Geldof forgiven now, seeing that he was checking out what was going on in Lybia at first hand. I doubt he is naive  enough to just turn up and take the money. 

What was the main contention anyway? That he was propping up Gadafi's regime by playing a concert?


Forgiven?  What for? And who am I to forgive?

I think it was naive to check things out in this manner and Geldof alluded to that before going.  I don't think, and never thought Geldof was in support of the regime.  I was wrong to say that he did it simply for the money.



-- Edited by ArrGee on Wednesday 14th of September 2011 12:14:25 PM

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Loudmouth

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I know Bob received no money for this, as it was billed as a charity, multi artist gig for the youth of Lybia. He was not the only one who performed that night.

I have taken the executive decision(on my own) to close this thread. It was 4 years ago and some awful untruths are still being toted in the press.

 

Scottie/Irene



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Scottie wrote:
I have taken the executive decision(on my own) to close this thread.

I don't see any reason to close this thread. 



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Back To Boomtown

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Scottie wrote:

It was 4 years ago and some awful untruths are still being toted in the press.


Fcuk the press.  Don't Believe What You Read.

I am sick and tired of this idea that the press read this forum looking for some juicy gossip on Geldof. There is not one story out there where a thread on this forum has been used as the basis of an article. 



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Loudmouth

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I was not suggesting they do. Just think it is time to put this to bed now.



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V Deep

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Just reading about this in Niall Powers (Bobs drummer)book.Apparantly the gig had bad vibes way before Bob and co started and Bob managed two and a half songs before all hell broke out and ended up in gunfire and god knows what else.



-- Edited by Derek The Dane on Wednesday 6th of September 2017 04:11:02 PM

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Lookin' After Number 1

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Hello, i can confirm the gig as i was there.

i kind of

thought that one day i would write a little piece on this but i just havent got around to it yet

it was pretty eventful to be honest. I was there as a technician with a speciality act that was performing in front of the stage.it was a prety weird gig ending in a riot of sorts. However it didnt seem to me like an angry mob but just Panicking crowd and bad management of the audience, if you like i can tell you some funny tales about what happened?

including-

being threatened by the english security detail then giving them the slip to go back and get our gear

laughing at a call to fall back to the compound

watching at close quarters as a gentleman was trying to placate a crowd on a stage mic just hastily vacated by bob while weilding a pistol in a slightly uncalm manner.

Getting assistance to pack our equipment From the rioting crowd and help from these rioters to form a human chain to protect our performers from being stampeded

 I think the band left pretty quickly after about two songs - the audience threw their slippers at them, then plastic chairs

leaving a site about an hour after the band as rioters climb light towers and flood the stage

going back the next day to find that all the bands gear was still where they left it onstage.. which was hard to imagine from a riot...

it was one of a few weird gigs that year, but the only one involving a huge ammount of automatic gunfire... i think the only time i heard gunfire before was when i lived in hackney in the 90s

obviously a gig in lybian for gadaffis son is a bit contrivercial..

but it was quite a funny gig

we ended up going to a local restaurant in a taxi after the gig - to the great frustration of the security team who seemed to think we should all hide in the hotel, i seem to remember having the fish!

Anyway - one day i guess i will write it all up! I think the backstage and crew often have the funniest stories.

-- Edited by Thunk123 on Monday 13th of November 2017 07:34:02 AM



-- Edited by Thunk123 on Monday 13th of November 2017 07:37:15 AM



-- Edited by Thunk123 on Monday 13th of November 2017 07:41:33 AM



-- Edited by Thunk123 on Monday 13th of November 2017 07:42:55 AM

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V Deep

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Ok,spil the beans,who are you?.


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Lookin' After Number 1

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I was there working as part of the fluff that went on during the show.

an act with hellium baloons with performers under them

i found a few photos in an old account



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V Deep

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Great photos,thanks for sharing.

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