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Banana Republic

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Was at the Royal Highland Show in Edinburgh at the weekend and they had invited the Masaii warrior troupe to perform. They gave a brilliant talk about their culture and performed a number of dances / songs. Afterwards they had beadwork items for sale - made by the families and friends of the 10 people that had come over (many had never been out of their villages never mind in a different country).


They had beautiful belts and wristbands with intricate beading (which I bought). The point being that ALL the money for these items went directly to the people. I spent 25 and feel that will make more of a difference to these people than heading over into Edinburgh (wasting money on bus and train fares this weekend). The wristband I now own is unique and hand made - not mass produced. Now I know most people won't have the same opertunity as I did to purchase items directly but over the last few weeks I've been attacked on this website for voicing my opinion about Bob etc. Just to let you know, I do care about the people of Africa but I also care about the people of Scotland. If you do come to Edinburgh, enjoy youselves but please respect the people who work and live here..


Cheers


 



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Banana Republic

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Just a thought..if the "1 million people" stay at home rather than travel to Edinburgh for the 6th then put the money they were going to spend into an envelope and send it to a recognised official charity then....


1 million people (spending on average 100 to come to Edinburgh, have a bite to eat etc)


100,000 x's 100 = 100,000,000


Add to that the clean up costs for those coming here (best of luck if you are staying at the Jack Kane centre near Niddrie - the locals might not be as friendly as you think they will be - they are putting up barb wire fencing to keep you lot safe). Also include the damage to property, insurance premium hikes, policing, hospital pay for overtime etc


Would that money not help to install clean drinking water, vaccinate children from disease, train teachers, nurses etc...in fact, many of the things the protesters and Bob would like to see happen in Africa...



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Tonight

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By taking part in the protest, they can and will sway international aid in the form of billions of dollars, not millions. That is why they don't do it.



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House on Fire

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Alison wrote:


Just a thought..if the "1 million people" stay at home rather than travel to Edinburgh for the 6th then put the money they were going to spend into an envelope and send it to a recognised official charity then.... 1 million people (spending on average 100 to come to Edinburgh, have a bite to eat etc) 100,000 x's 100 = 100,000,000 Add to that the clean up costs for those coming here (best of luck if you are staying at the Jack Kane centre near Niddrie - the locals might not be as friendly as you think they will be - they are putting up barb wire fencing to keep you lot safe). Also include the damage to property, insurance premium hikes, policing, hospital pay for overtime etc Would that money not help to install clean drinking water, vaccinate children from disease, train teachers, nurses etc...in fact, many of the things the protesters and Bob would like to see happen in Africa...

You offer plasters to treat fever.

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Banana Republic

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ADMIN: Don't abuse fellow board members.  Any more of this and you will be banned.



-- Edited by ArrGee at 20:20, 2005-07-01

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Banana Republic

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I was merely stating that this money could be used more efficiently than trashing Edinburgh...



-- Edited by Alison at 09:16, 2005-06-29

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House on Fire

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And I was stating it is not about raising money, but about raising awareness levels.  I don't see how a million people sitting in their living rooms is going to raise awareness.  That happens every day.  It's called apathy.

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Banana Republic

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Oh so all the people that will watch Live 8 on the BBC / listen to it on the radio etc because that's EXACTLY what they will be doing are somehow apathetic are they...I don't think they'd agree!!!


 



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Banana Republic

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I await your witty response.....

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Banana Republic

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oeokosko: Out of interest, have you contributed directly to the African cause, either monetary or hands on in the country? If you have, then I applaud you, If you have not......Then stop trying to preach on something that you can only contrive as hearsay!

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ADMIN: Removed on the poster's request


-- Edited by ArrGee at 23:00, 2005-07-01

-- Edited by ArrGee at 23:01, 2005-07-01

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House on Fire

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Alison wrote:


Oh so all the people that will watch Live 8 on the BBC / listen to it on the radio etc because that's EXACTLY what they will be doing are somehow apathetic are they...I don't think they'd agree!!!  

You were talking about the day of the "1 million people" demonstration in Edinburgh on 6th July, not about the Live 8 concerts day on 2nd July, so I don't see your point.

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Tonight

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"

Smallpox was wiped out by just over US$100m worth of targeted aid. Polio is also close to being eliminated.


Mozambique's economy grew at an astonishing 12 per cent in the 1990s when aid constituted 50 per cent of its income.


In Tanzania, debt relief enabled the government to abolish primary school fees, leading to a whopping 66 per cent increase in attendance. As a result, 1.6million more children now attend school.


Debt relief helped kick-start Mozambique's impressive recovery from civil war and terrible floods and enabled its government to vaccinate 500,000 additional children.


NOW IS THE TIME, THIS IS THE YEAR - OUR LEADERS HAVE THE POWER TO END POVERTY - BUT WE HAVE THE POWER TO MAKE THEM USE IT" - http://www.live8live.com



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Banana Republic

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oeokosko: You still have not replied to my question regarding your contribution. Your 'private message' had no subject matter and no content!

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Banana Republic

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"I don't see how a million people sitting in their living rooms is going to raise awareness.  That happens every day.  It's called apathy"


"You were talking about the day of the "1 million people" demonstration in Edinburgh on 6th July, not about the Live 8 concerts day on 2nd July, so I don't see your point."


oeokosko,


...and here's me thinking that the protest marches in Scotland and concerts to raise awareness were for the same cause - just that TO RAISE AWARENESS OF THE AFRICAN CAUSE


Now, not everyone will be able to go to either Edinburgh or to the Live 8 concerts so to condemn others for sitting watching the TV (to see Live 8 OR watch the coverage of the protests) and not taking part personally is patronising to say the least.


Please consider your comments before you fire off a rant...



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House on Fire

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Alison, you were talking about the "1 million person" protest in Edinbugh on 6th July and your suggestion - yet again - was that those people stay at home and instead give the money that they would otherwise have spent on travel.  You came to a figure of 100m and then considered any saving on clearing up Edinburgh.  I have no problem going with your sums as you calculate them (although of course there are going to be - and would have been anyway, even without Sir Bob's bright idea - other protests in Edinburgh over the coming week that the same sort of people will be going to anyway).


However, you fundamentally miss the point of that particular protest in Edinburgh, which is to draw attention to the African debt problem.  A bit of money like that won't solve the problem as the debt is just a symptom - pay off the debt and it will just come back again and again unless radical changes are made in the way (sub-Saharan) Africa is governed.  This is what I meant by the plasters and fever analogy.  The radical changes include tackling corruption, not just at the top, but at all levels of society since corruption is endemic in many parts of Africa.  But what causes the corruption?  Part of it is inherrent in African culture (simplistically, 'tribalism' and other forms of patronage) and must be tackled by Africans themselves and part of it is caused by the way that we in the North carry out unfair trade with Africa.


If those million people stay at home on 6th July (in their living rooms), then how does that help raising awareness?  Remember that, in your world, there is no protest for them to watch on the telly.  This seems more like ignoring the problem and I would call that apathy.  When did sitting passively at home ever change the world?



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Tonight

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Alison is worried about what will happen to Edinburgh with so many people, and I think her opinion should be respected. We had in Washington DC the "Million Man March" in the late 90's for African-American men to show that they wanted to stop black-on-black violence and give attention to men helping to raise children well. We were all worried but everything was fine. But we didn't have outsiders coming for the purpose of making trouble, so that's a big difference.I am checking the news daily about protest plans and it sounds like a large number of the protesters really are not going to be from Edinburgh at all. Well, how about for the residents who don't want to go, they could have some sort of ribbon decoration to display in support of the idea? Maybe a white ribbon? It would mean "I support you" but at the same time, mean to be peaceful and don't ruin everything. If there's trouble, it'll make things worse for the purpose of the marches. A nice Kente cloth (bright colors from Ghana would be nice ) ribbon would be good; there are probably some African stores to buy from. I know it sound kind of stupid, but just an idea!



-- Edited by motema2004 at 20:03, 2005-07-01

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Alison, I'll ignore all the posts inbetween and write a sensible response,maybe?

I agree fair trade is a good way forward and should be encouraged. obviously we cannot buy directly as you did on a daily basis, but buying fair trade products is the next best thing. Products made for and profits made by the people themselves, cut out the middle man.

The event you went to sounds really interesting. Are they travelling around the country or was it a one off event in Edinburgh.

I hope the march is successful, fruitful but remains peaceful and controlled.

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Banana Republic

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mags wrote:


oeokosko: Out of interest, have you contributed directly to the African cause, either monetary or hands on in the country? If you have, then I applaud you, If you have not......Then stop trying to preach on something that you can only contrive as hearsay!

oeokosko: Have you not got the guts to give a true answer????????

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Tonight

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Hi all of you, how was Edinburgh? In US we heard 225,000 people and not much trouble. What's the news? How does everything look? As Jules says and as Nelson Mandela says, more trade but it's not just small items, it would be textiles, for example cotton. I used to have a store that sold ethnic merchandise. It was a good experience but I didn't make much profit, I still have some nice things & sell them at festivals. I loved it! there are so many beautiful crafts!The craftspeople would come to my store with their wares and I was what is called an easy mark, but I felt I was helping. Africa has some beautiful jewelry & beadwork, sculpture, carving, but what they want to market is large items, automobiles or tractors--I'm afraid the diamonds , gold & oil are causing problems with the corruption, alas. I wish we led simple lives and really COULD give directly. Guess I will be happy with the beautiful crafts and art, though. PS by profit I meant enough to pay the rent, not "profit" profit!

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mags wrote:



mags wrote: oeokosko: Out of interest, have you contributed directly to the African cause, either monetary or hands on in the country? If you have, then I applaud you, If you have not......Then stop trying to preach on something that you can only contrive as hearsay! oeokosko: Have you not got the guts to give a true answer????????



mags, if you did not have such a rude and aggressive attitude here and in another thread where you say "there is nothing wrong with constuctive critisim but you are not even worthy of that because you are so self opinionated" then I might answer.  Might, but probably wouldn't, as you frame your question in a closed and prejudged way.



-- Edited by oeokosko at 10:14, 2005-07-07

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Banana Republic

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Thanks for the lovely comments. Nice to see you and  i would get on so well if ever we met!!!!.

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Well, it's a terrible day because of the terrorist attacks in London, so to see you two going at each other seems a bit out of place at the moment; but on the other hand, picturing Kermit the Frog and Che Guevarra in a boxing match brings a chuckle, sorry.

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Banana Republic

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Kermit would win. Yahooo.


It is a shame about London. All our thoughts are with their families.



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