British/Irish singers and accents

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

British/Irish singers and accents

Tango · In the Long Grass

kate rusby keeps hers.so does shane macgowan most of the time.i guess your singing voice is often completely different to your speaking voice and it just depends what type of singing you do.james bourne (ex busted member, now son of dork lead singer) puts on the most horrible american accent eve when he's talking, he's from Southend-On-Sea for pete's sake.

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

Is it supposed to be cool?

Tango · In the Long Grass

i guess so but in the end you just sound like a prick.the irish accent is by far the best.while we're on accents can someone please explain why all american t.v. shows etc. seem to thing all brits sound like a member of the royal family a.k.a. upper class snobs

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

It's probably another form of 'Americanism' - something which Bob was mouthing off about a couple of years ago - how American English is creeping into British English.

I find watching American made films of the UK hilarious. What's that film with Michael Palin, based in Oxford. All Oxford students have the same hair and wear long scarves according to that.

Perhaps those from States could say whether they are able to differentiate between regional accents in the UK? That would be understandable, maybe then.

franna · V Deep

Why does this happen? I'd guess, 1) either it's a natural occurrence when they're singing, 2) they think it's cool, or 3) they've been advised that if they ever hope to crack the American market and make serious money, it would be helpful.

I can't comment on the Michael Palin/Oxford movie, because I don't know what it is, or if I've seen it. If you give me more info, perhaps I'll rent it.

Re Americanisms penetrating British English: Get over it. It's called globalization, my friends. Not to mention the reason why English is such a large, fluid, useful language to begin with. Study the history of the English language sometime. And if it makes you feel any better, British English is making inroads into American English as well.

As for why all the English sound like upper class snobs in American media....well, first of all England and Ireland are woefully misrepresented in many, many ways. I suspect the same is true of the way America is depicted in British/Irish produced media. (We all reinforce the stereotypes that sell locally.) All I can say is that I was shocked by the difference between my expectation and reality when I went to England and Ireland.

For the specific question, why do they all sound like upper class snobs...1) We don't think they sound like upper class snobs. We simply think that's what an English accent sounds like. At it's most basic level, we know there is such a thing as a "Cockney" accent, but I'd think there is a low class stereotype attached to that one (thanks to Dick Van Dyke in Mary Poppins), and more importantly, we'd need subtitles to understand what is being said. Although, it might be edging on cool these days...now that I think about it, there's a cartoon lizard with a Cockney accent who's a spokesman for a car insurance company these days....

Can we distinguish regional accents? Only to a limited degree. I suppose we could tell that the person was from England (or the UK generally), but probably couldn't say where (the more sophisticated among us might be able to say "London" or "North" [Scotland might be more obvious - but I've no idea what Wales sounds like], so that's about as far as it would get).

More important than distinguishing among regional accents, is simply being able to understand what is being said. In TV news stories, there often WILL be subtitles. When watching UK films, especially say, Quadrophenia or Trainspotting, I WISHED there had been subtitles. Even stuff like Bend it Like Beckham (the list could go on and on, practically every domestically produced UK or IE film) involves moments of turning to your neighbor and asking 'what did they say?', getting a shrug of cluelessness in return, and hitting the rewind button several times before finally giving up and moving on.

Still, the influx of movies like Beckham, and the web, and all the rest of it, are slowly making other accents more understandable...so over time, perhaps this will change.

But for the moment, a Hollywood produced movie, which is designed for a worldwide audience from the outset, will always aim for what is most easily understood and marketed. Outside the UK, 'upper class snob' is the accent Americans (and probably others) recognize as signifying 'Oh! They're English!" so you can give the film a sense of place, and the dialogue can still be easily understood without subtitles. (Relatively few outside the UK will ever make a class/snob connection to that accent.)

If it bothers you, perhaps you should blame the BBC.

ArrGee · Back To Boomtown

Tango wrote:

.so does shane macgowan most of the time.

Ah yes, that accent so commonly heard in Tunbridge Wells.

Tango · In the Long Grass

we don't want to be overrun with americanism, why can'y a biscuit be a biscuit be a biscuit and a cookie a cookie.rubbish sounds much nicer than trash and so on and so forth.with regards to subtitling english films;why?we put up with the american accent which is frankly a little testing at times and we tune in to what is said even if it takes a while.i and many other brits may find it difficult to understand what is being said in a cockney accent or a yorkshire one, but we don't require subtitles we just get on with it.most brits don't sound like upper class snobs.there are a few well spoken members of society such as stephen fry and others of that generation but right in the here and now we don't sound like that.we don't exhaust superlatives(sorry had to do that) and speak like shakesperean actors.

ArrGee · Back To Boomtown

Tango wrote:

we don't want to be overrun with americanism, why can'y a biscuit be a biscuit be a biscuit and a cookie a cookie.rubbish sounds much nicer than trash and so on and so forth.with regards to subtitling english films;why?we put up with the american accent which is frankly a little testing at times and we tune in to what is said even if it takes a while.i and many other brits may find it difficult to understand what is being said in a cockney accent or a yorkshire one, but we don't require subtitles we just get on with it.most brits don't sound like upper class snobs.there are a few well spoken members of society such as stephen fry and others of that generation but right in the here and now we don't sound like that.we don't exhaust superlatives(sorry had to do that) and speak like shakesperean actors.

Stephen Fry and others of his generation are well spoken.... (Are the rest of us are just sh!t on the soles of the shoes of Oxbridge graduates?)

Time to leave England, methinks.

Meanwhile, while I'm in the process of selling up, you may find this interesting http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_and_British_English_differences

PS The profanity filter on this forum is a real pain in the ar$e! (or ass if you prefer!)

-- Edited by ArrGee at 16:30, 2006-02-23

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

Fran

Thanks for responding to that. Your post is really interesting. I hadn't realised British English had crept into the States! So you suffer from 'Britishism'

.

I can't remember the name of that film, if it comes to me I'll post it. It is very funny the perceptions we have of each other or elsewhere and the stereotypes we have. I realise that isn't just one way and often wonder when I'm watching something what an American viewer might think.

Are there such regional differences in accents in the States? I know the difference between north and south, but beyond that...

There is a tendency, but this is no means strictly the rule, that middle and upper class people may have no marked accent, or a less strong accent, while working class might have a stronger accent. I say that it is only a tendency and not always the case.

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

My memory does work sometimes... The film was called American Friends. See if you can find it in the States Fran and let me know what you think.

Katharina · Dave

From an “outsider’s” point of view, this discussion is somewhat… funny! As someone who learnt English as a foreign language, I’m happy if I understand what is being said in the language I spent many hours on learning... And I understand rubbish as well as trash! lol

When I learned English in school, it was up to the teacher which standard to teach, that usually depended on where the teachers had learned the language themselves. In spelling, both AE and BE standard was accepted.

Languages have changed at all times in history. They have to, because languages are not static. A language “lives” with its speakers. Many of the changes that have taken place in languages were triggered by political change in the country (example: the influence of Scottish English in the Irish English spoken in Northern Ireland in the 17th century, when Scottish settlers were “planted” there to prevent catholic rebellion – there are hundreds of other examples). You may or may not agree with the political developments – your language will change, if you want it or not. It’s a natural process, stopping it from changing is very difficult, involves a lot of planning and often suppression and doesn’t always work (example: The French try to prevent English vocabulary coming into the language).

If you don’t want to change your language into a certain direction or if you consider aspects of it worthwhile keeping, there’s a very simple way: use it! And use it correctly. Show others your language is beautiful and valuable. It’s the only way to keep variety alive.

@ Tango: I’d find your English even more beautiful if you’d brush it up with paragraphs!

Tango · In the Long Grass

sorry paragraphs is a severe downdall of mine

(Are the rest of us are just sh!t on the soles of the shoes of Oxbridge graduates?)

why do people say crap like that!the way you talk has bugger all to do with who you are so why would you even think that i was suggesting you we 're all thick or useless.i happen to adore stephen fry's way of speaking.the use of words such as 'creamily' make it so much more amusing.and a large proprtion of american's my age seem to think it's cute, which i must say i find disturbing.anyway my poiny is there is nothing wrong with being well spoken or not.we should all just be proud to be who we are, and speak how we see fit for the occasion

franna · V Deep

Tango wrote:

anyway my poiny is there is nothing wrong with being well spoken or not.we should all just be proud to be who we are, and speak how we see fit for the occasion

While that may have been your poiny, it was not expressed in any of your earlier posts. In fact, you seem to espouse quite the opposite view.

Let's see, you insulted the entirety of the US (and American English generally), plus a large segment of the UK population.... no, I'm sorry, you insulted the entirety of the UK population as well (Northern Irish excepted).

-- Edited by franna at 14:05, 2006-02-24

ArrGee · Back To Boomtown

Tango wrote:

sorry paragraphs is a severe downdall of mine (Are the rest of us are just sh!t on the soles of the shoes of Oxbridge graduates?) why do people say crap like that!the way you talk has bugger all to do with who you are so why would you even think that i was suggesting you we 're all thick or useless.i happen to adore stephen fry's way of speaking.the use of words such as 'creamily' make it so much more amusing.and a large proprtion of american's my age seem to think it's cute, which i must say i find disturbing.anyway my poiny is there is nothing wrong with being well spoken or not.we should all just be proud to be who we are, and speak how we see fit for the occasion

downdall?

I wrote it, I didn't say it. (Use a ? on a question.)

the way you talk has bugger all to do with who you are so why would you even think that i was suggesting you we 're all thick or useless - This is incomprehensible.

I think Stephen Fry is a wanker.

american's - No apostrophe on a plural.

my poiny - What! The little one?

You wrote that most English people are not well-spoken, which is not my experience. Even worse, you implied that only the Oxbridge set could possibly hope to be well-spoken. Many of us speak clearly without sounding as if we have plums in our gobs and dicks up our asses/ar$es. I have no problem with this so-called Americanism.

Tango · In the Long Grass

look slag me off all you like and the way i speak write or anything else.but if you don't mind i'd like to be able to mention my heroes without getting kicked into the floor

ArrGee · Back To Boomtown

Katharina wrote:

If you don’t want to change your language into a certain direction or if you consider aspects of it worthwhile keeping, there’s a very simple way: use it! And use it correctly. Show others your language is beautiful and valuable. It’s the only way to keep variety alive.

Amen! People with English as a second/third language write so accurately and eloquently. I think we should adopt German English

ArrGee · Back To Boomtown

Tango wrote:

look slag me off all you like and the way i speak write or anything else.but if you don't mind i'd like to be able to mention my heroes without getting kicked into the floor

I did not slag you off. You, however, did slag off 99% of the population, myself included. Am I supposed to let you kick us all into the floor?

Tango · In the Long Grass

I agree!I was watching the olympics this morning and there was a guy from cameroon and his second language was french he spoke fluent italian as he lived in turin and still spoke perfect english.and yet many of us can just about struggle our way through a meal in france or spain.

franna · V Deep

ArrGee wrote:

Tango wrote: look slag me off all you like and the way i speak write or anything else.but if you don't mind i'd like to be able to mention my heroes without getting kicked into the floor I did not slag you off. You, however, did slag off 99% of the population, myself included. Am I supposed to let you kick us all into the floor?

Yeah, what ArrGee said. Although the way I read it, I think Tango slagged off 100% of the Brits.

I took her to mean that in Tango's view of the UK, you're either poorly spoken or you're an upper class snob / prick. Since she has only compliments for the Irish, I'll assume that the Northern Irish fall within her "Irish" category.

But hey, I'm still struggling with the slag concept. And am I bitching about it? No.

I think I'll clean my apartment. Maybe there's an empty cookie box somewhere that I can throw in the garbage.

Tango · In the Long Grass

grrr *wrestles with frustration*.maybe i just shouldn't speak as everything i say gets taken the wrong way.when i said well spoken it didn't mean that the rest of us are crap.general statements seem unnacceptable out of the realms of teens

ArrGee · Back To Boomtown

Tango wrote:

grrr *wrestles with frustration*.maybe i just shouldn't speak as everything i say gets taken the wrong way.when i said well spoken it didn't mean that the rest of us are crap.general statements seem unnacceptable out of the realms of teens

You bemoan the creeping Americanism into English, yet you write English that is incomprehensible, especially to those for whom English is not a first language. You shouldn't be surprised that you are misinterpreted. Try using the shift key, the space bar and the return key. You might find people a little less critical.

No one wants to stop you "speaking", it's just reading through things two or three times to try to understand them that's frustrating.

franna · V Deep

In addition to learning about the space bar, shift, and return keys, I'd suggest you try to improve your spelling.

But most importantly, I'd ask that you try to develop the habit of thinking before you click the "submit post" button. A bit of asking oneself "does what I wrote accurately represent what I meant to say?" can be quite helpful.

Sometimes, you'll still screw up. We all do. But the percentage will decrease dramatically.

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

Oh dear what did I start?

This was meant for discussion - not for slagging each other off

Oh well it got you all talking.

ArrGee · Back To Boomtown

Jules wrote:

Oh dear what did I start? This was meant for discussion - not for slagging each other off

I was not slagging anyone off, but I find it offensive that only those who graduate from public schools and Oxbridge are considered well-spoken and the rest of us are just sh!t on the soles of their shoes. What makes it worse is when those of us that aspire to be better than our birthright supposedly "just get on with it".

Without wishing to appear racist or snobby (which I'm sure I will), I was on the tube today and heard these two boys speaking. At first, I thought they were a bit touched, so incomprehensible was their conversation. After a while I thought, oh no, they're black. Only when I looked up from my paper, did I see two obese white boys dressed like black boys speaking.

Now I live in a far nicer part of town than the part I was born and brought up in. But now in what is a surburban area, in addition to the above, we now have graffiti and break dancers outside the Golf Club! Hell, I thought I left the council estates and the sink schools long behind, but now chav culture is becoming the norm.

If only my grandmother had married Al Capone.....

franna · V Deep

If your grandmother had married Al Capone, wouldn't you be American? You'd still be guilty.

BTW - "on the tube"....at first I thought you'd appeared on television today, but it was hard to fit the rest of the sentence into that context. Then I thought you'd been reading the paper with the television on as background noise. Finally, I understood that you most likely meant "on the tube" to describe transportation! ROFL

Tribute to ArrGee Song of the Day: Paul Simon - Diamonds on the Soles of Her Shoes

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

ArrGee wrote:

Jules wrote:

Without wishing to appear racist or snobby (which I'm sure I will), I was on the tube today and heard these two boys speaking. At first, I thought they were a bit touched, so incomprehensible was their conversation. After a while I thought, oh no, they're black. Only when I looked up from my paper, did I see two obese white boys dressed like black boys speaking.

This seems to be a chav culture now. White kids talking with West Indian accents? What is that all about? Is this a rap thing? I'm not sure if that's the kind of conversation you witnessed ArrGee?

I love Fran's interpretation of 'on the tube'. You obviously haven't suffered that 'Britishism' so far.

Tango · In the Long Grass

I really don't understand chav culture these days. They won't accept that they are neither rappers or black (I'm not being racist). They just need to accept who they are, normal British kids

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

Be careful Tango, you sound like a 40 year old!!

Fran, what is the tube called in the States - having a debate about it here (at home) and being told tube is an Americanism. Well if a New Yorker didn't know what it meant it clearly isn't!!! I just can't remember what I've heard it being referred to by Americans.

franna · V Deep

I can only speak as a New Yorker. The mode of transportation is normally referred to as "the subway" (or "the train", but that includes the suburban commuter rail lines) and slang for television is "the tube" (from "the boob tube" because too much exposure makes one an idiot).

Now, if it had been obvious at the beginning of the sentence that ArrGee was travelling...if he'd said "I was on the tube to Victoria Station, happily minding my own business, when..." I'd have known what he meant. I think most Americans know that "tube" means "subway" in the UK, it's just not the first meaning that comes to mind (at least not for a NYer).

It's possible that other cities call their subways tubes....let me think...in Philly I think it's still the subway (but let's face facts, while they fight me on this, Philly is just a NYC suburb), in Chicago it's definitely the "El" (shortened form of Elevated, but they call the whole thing the El, whether or not it's above ground), in Washington DC it's definitely the "Metro", In Boston I think it's most commonly referred to by the color coding ("take the green line", or "take the red line", or whatever)...in San Francisco I think it's "BART" (Bay Area Rapid Transit), no idea about LA or elsewhere.

Oh, Jules, as to your earlier question about regional dialects. Of course there are. Maine is not Boston is not New York is not Philadelphia is not Maryland, etc. all the way across the country. (In fact, a common accent among Northern California men sounds positively gay to my ears! "Is he gay, or is he just from Northern California?") And for the NYC area, Brooklyn is not The Bronx is not Long Island, etc. We can't even agree on the proper name for a sandwich (sub, hero, hoagie, etc.) and a drink (soda, pop).

-- Edited by franna at 14:00, 2006-02-25

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

Thanks for both, Fran. You have settled an argument for me on the tube/subway

He did try to continue to insist that tube was an Americanism, but I read a bit of your post and advised him you are New Yorker. No-one can argue with that!!!! Well maybe men can...

I can't hear the difference in regional accents in the US (apart from North and South), and can fully appreciate that you wouldn't know the difference over here either. It would probably be easier if I actually visited the States and travelled from State to State, then I would hear it.

franna · V Deep

I'd have to insist that calling NYC underground mass transit the "tube" is a "Britishism."

http://www.mta.nyc.ny.us/nyct/maps/submap.htm

http://www.transitmuseumstore.com/

http://www.nycsubway.org/

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

Thanks again. I knew I hadn't heard the NY underground system being referred to as the tube on US TV progs or films. Subway makes sense completely. It was difficult to argue without any prove, but you have now provided me with that.

Katharina · Dave

ArrGee wrote:

Katharina wrote: If you don’t want to change your language into a certain direction or if you consider aspects of it worthwhile keeping, there’s a very simple way: use it! And use it correctly. Show others your language is beautiful and valuable. It’s the only way to keep variety alive. Amen! People with English as a second/third language write so accurately and eloquently. I think we should adopt German English

Ahhh ArrGee! Heaven forbid!

"Accurately and eloquently" - could I have some more of that please?

Katharina · Dave

Jules wrote:

I can't hear the difference in regional accents in the US (apart from North and South), and can fully appreciate that you wouldn't know the difference over here either. It would probably be easier if I actually visited the States and travelled from State to State, then I would hear it.

I'm sure you could if you travelled around! I usually hear differences (though I wouldn't be able to put my finger on them or even reproduce them), but then I love all accents and dialects. I like trying to guess where someone is from - here, varieties are really more based on the region you come from than on "social class".

On "chav culture" etc. - have you ever wondered if these are new linguistical varieties being born?

In modern German, there's a great influence of English words and phrases (some of which don't even exist in "real" English - we made them sound like English, but they aren't, like "Handy" for a mobile/cell phone). Maybe this "Denglisch" ("Deutsch" and "Englisch" mixed) will become the new standard? Of course, like anywhere else, many people hate the Denglisch, they want to turn back time and have the old language back. Back in a few generations time, maybe it will just be normal?

It's really sad that so many languages/varieties die out, they all blend together and become indistinguishable. But what about the thought that if globally more languages die out, more people will be able to understand each other? I'm not sure I like the idea of a "world language", but wouldn't it make things a lot easier? 1

My thought for the lunch break!

1 By the way - free lunch break association... the tower of Babel, Old Testament of the Bible (Genesis) - when Jahwe punishes the people who try to build a very high tower and who refused to accept him, by introducing different languages, so they couldn't understand each other anymore...

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

Well that was a very inspirational lunch break. It is probably inevitable languages will merge with globalisation and evolve into something new. But there are so many in the world, will we leave some behind who aren't 'globalised'?

dam9191 · House on Fire

Hello: This is a very interesting discussion. I would only like to add that I'm in the midwest (in Minnesota) and even here, most of the people I talk to do not sound like the movie "Fargo" (made by two native Minnesotans the Coen Brothers).

That movie made it appear that we all sound like that, when really very few do.

I believe most Americans when listening to different English accents can tell in general the differences (especially Scottish or Irish accents).

take care,

debm

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

So why do natives produce films with such inaccuracy?

It beats me.

Another singer who's accent is heard on singing is David Bowie, another band is Big Country.

Debm can you tell the difference between regional accents? Or simply the north/south divide? It's strange how the more pronounced accents appear in the north here and in the south in the US. Can you tell the difference between regional scottish and irish accents? And northern and southern Ireland

Now there's a thing...

franna · V Deep

Jules - when I was living in Ireland I could tell the difference between north & south, not so sure I could anymore.

And for your time-wasting pleasure: the "What Kind of American English Do You Speak" quiz: http://www.blogthings.com/whatkindofamericanenglishdoyouspeakquiz/

I am:
45% Yankee
35% General American English
15% Dixie
0% Midwestern
0% Upper Midwestern

How'd the Dixie get in there?

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

Well I just had to do that. Considering I still call 'movies' films/going to the pictures and pronounce schedule sh and not sk:

***Your Linguistic Profile::***

50% General American English

25% Yankee

15% Dixie

5% Midwestern

0% Upper Midwestern

It should in reality be 0% across the board

-- Edited by Jules at 13:37, 2006-05-17

franna · V Deep

Maybe we should both blame Steve for the Dixie.....

Tango · In the Long Grass

wow.i got exactly the same as jules

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

That must be the 'british' English score then!!!! No accounting for north/south divide in the UK though

Rita · House on Fire

I got:

45% General American English

25% Yankee

15% Dixie

5% Upper Midwestern

0% Midwestern

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

I just noticed (doh) they don't add up to !00%, what is rest made up of I wonder?

franna · V Deep

Jules wrote:

I just noticed (doh) they don't add up to !00%, what is rest made up of I wonder?

You're right!! ROTFLMAO

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

We're all 5% short of a picnic...

Julia · Tonight

Well ... this girl from Oz got:

35% General American English

35% Yankee

20% Dixie

5% Upper Midwestern

0% Midwestern

It still doesn't add up though! Interesting that both Jules and Rita got the highest % (minus 5!) as General American English, substantially higher than their next highest, Yankee. Though it doesn't surprise me I got a bit of an all round of GAE, Yankee and Dixie (though I hope to god I don't sound like a southern belle!!).

A couple of questions didn't have a correct option for me, so I just put in what was closest:

1. The level of a building that is underground is called the:

Cellar

Basement

We use both, though large buildings such as hospitals, office blocks, large shops etc have 'basements' (hence 'bargain basement'), while if it refers to houses, it would probably be called a cellar (hence 'wine cellar'). I've never actually known anyone who's had a cellar/basement - likewise we don't tend to have attics either ... very boring.

5. You call sweetened, carbonated beverages:
Soda
Pop
Coke

We don't use 'soda' this way; here 'soda water' is carbonated water but it's anything but sweet and is used as a mixer eg 'brandy, lime and soda'. Pop is definately not used.

It's only called 'coke' if it IS Coke (or Pepsi, I suppose). Imitation coke is often just called 'Cola'. We tend to use the actual names, though with kids it's often 'fizzy drink'.

10. What do you call an easy class?
A crip course
A gut
A blow off

The mind boggles at this one - I've never heard of any of these and would want to be very wary where I used the last one.

13. What is the four wheeled contraption you push around your groceries in?
Buggy
Carriage
Shopping/grocery cart

The third alternative is very close, but we calll them 'shopping trolleys', or more often just 'trolleys'. A buggy would be a horse-drawn vehicle; a carriage also but with a sense of being grand rather than common.

Re accents and music, I'd always thought that the transfer of speech into song usually eliminated accents, given the singing was in the same language. i.e. that the process of singing is different to speaking. Take a boy's choir for an easy example - I don't imagine there would be much difference in the sound whether they were from the UK, US or Australia.

So, when singers do have accents, I've just thought they were unusual or practiced in keeping the accent. There are certainly some Oz bands that keep the Oz accent more than others - usually as a mark of who they are.

The Oz accent is not state (geographically) bound, let alone distinctly different within a particular city. Yes, it varies but is essentially the same everywhere. Instead, because we are so multicultural - espescially in the cities - the accents to be heard are those from other countries.

Amazing what can result from setting up a penal colony in a far off land ...

dam9191 · House on Fire

Jules wrote:

So why do natives produce films with such inaccuracy? It beats me. Another singer who's accent is heard on singing is David Bowie, another band is Big Country. Debm can you tell the difference between regional accents? Or simply the north/south divide? It's strange how the more pronounced accents appear in the north here and in the south in the US. Can you tell the difference between regional scottish and irish accents? And northern and southern Ireland Now there's a thing...

I think in the Coen Brothers case in "Fargo", they did it for a stylistic reasons; they wanted their film to sound a specific way. They have done that with other accents and film styles in other movies.

I haven't traveled very much, so my experience in hearing other accents (esp. European/Great Britian accents) is fairly limited. So, I'm not really sure what the answer is. [I know, I need to get out more.]

I'm always amazed when a British actor can do an American accent so well. For example, Claude Rains in the movie "They Won't Forget" does a very good American Southern accent. Emma Thompson does a very good American accent in "Primary Colors".

Regarding the type of English I speak, according to the quiz:

***Your Linguistic Profile::***

65% General American English

15% Upper Midwestern

10% Yankee

5% Midwestern

0% Dixie

What Kind of American English Do You Speak?
http://www.blogthings.com/whatkindofamericanenglishdoyouspeakquiz/

take care, debm

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

Julia

Australian English sounds closer to British English!! We also use the term shopping trolley. Soda also is a carbonated water here. We may call it carbonated soft drinks pop though, not Coke - that is just Coke, it doesn't cover lemonade etc. And your reacton to question no. 10 was interestingly much like mine!! Some of those questions were totally irrelevant and I just too the nearest I could.

Julia · Tonight

Jules wrote:

Australian English sounds closer to British English!!

I'm sure it is - even though there's many different ethnicities, the original English-speaking stock were from England & Ireland (N & Republic), and Oz is a lot 'younger' than the US, so it's had less time to change dramatically. Also, I don't think Oz shares the apparent US passion to be different from the UK. And of course we're still part of the Commonwealth, so there are still strong (but largely irrelevant) ties to English Royalty - unfortunately ... the sooner we can get it together to form a republic and have an Australian Head of State, the better.

I grew up with "God Save The Queen" as our National Anthem; I think that's one reason why many Australians (myself included) don't know all the words to "Advance Australia Fair", though (unfortunately) the words to GSTQ are embedded in my psyche.

Yes, no. 10 was quite educational !!!

We'd call an 'easy class' a 'bludge' - that's the only one I can think of.

From my trusty Macquarie:

bludge - n. Australian, NZ Colloquial a job which entails next to no work. Also v. to be idle; do nothing; to evade responsibilities. Hence bludger, n. [my addition; used most frequently in the phrase 'dole bludger']

Someone help me out; in this thread there's been quite a few mentions of "chav culture" - I've no idea what it is

Katharina · Dave

As a non-native speaker of English who learnt English in a (West-)German school, I got this:

35% General American English

30% Yankee

20% Dixie

5% Upper Midwestern

0% Midwestern

It's similar to Julia's profile!

I spent exactly six days of my life in the US. What a nice waste of time!

Julia · Tonight

That's really interesting, Katherina, that your profile was more like mine than the Brits or the US people. I would have thought it would be more like UK-English, in terms of a standard for English as second language (of which, by the way, I think you have great mastery - I'd never pick it wasn't your first language).

I wonder if our similarity is the product of being influenced by both UK-English and US-English. "Australian-English" is certainly a mix of the two along with its own peculiaraties.

It would be interesting to do a similar quiz based on spelling; that's one area where the differences really show up. In Oz, we generally use UK spelling (eg. always 'centre', never 'center'), though in some cases either UK or US spelling is accepted (eg. 'organisation' or 'organization').

BTW, I realise this has got nothing to do with singers and accents - whether it's spelt 'colour' or 'color', the expression in song is *fairly much* the same.

Oh, unless you count the US classic immortalised in "When Harry Met Sally" ... 'You say tomarto, I say tomaito; you say potarto, I say potaito ...'

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

Julia we strayed off the original topic ages ago. It was actually about singing with a pseudo US accent, not talking. However, it is has been an interesting discussion

so don't worry about moving it on to writing!

roxane · She's So Modern

Jules wrote:

Julia we strayed off the original topic ages ago. It was actually about singing with a pseudo US accent, not talking. However, it is has been an interesting discussion so don't worry about moving it on to writing!

Bob sang Sir George Best's funeral before he died (ST David's Hall Cardiff 11.11.06.). Accents ranged from a beautiful Irish love song voice for the Eulogy poem 'Ireland's Boy' which I mistook for a love song, to hints of US and Belgian and posh English as he sang the religious hymns. It must be traumatic for him and the band because they would have been trying to prevent the death. They must have understood it was a religious service not a creative take on lifeeg the album title 'Sex,Age and Death' convinced me that this was planned, rehearsed music not an accident. Bob is very religious. He went to temples and churches all over the world with his lovely friend Princess Diana.

Bob was given an honourary US citizenship. He's quite cosmopolitan so he's had quite a few over the years including some African ones that I remember. It would be good to find out where his book signing tour for the sequel to Geldof In Africa is taking him because he was recently near me in South Wales at the Hay festival and may welcome questions or visits from people trying to support the human rights efforts. He is giving a free business lecture to Welsh businesses at Cardiff's Millenium stadium on 13.06.06. ickets available online. This website is very weak because the live8 page doesn't mention the new book or the book signing yet prevents us looking elsewhere for info on these topics because there is a large part of the site dedicated to this.

Scottie · Loudmouth

Roxane, Bob is NOT religious in the slightest. He is athiest, he told me himself, as well as a few hundred other people, who were there at the time. He said that what he sees in Africa proves that there is not a God. This is a fact.

Julia · Tonight

Jules wrote: Julia we strayed off the original topic ages ago.

Yeah, it's been a very diverse thread. Something I wonder about from time to time is how weird it would be to hear each other's accents. Imagine an audio chat (I'd even get up early on Sunday morning to be in that!!) - or even more daring, an audio-visual chat!! I'm sure these exist in some form, and will probably be old hat in 20 years.

Could any of us (who were around w-a-y back then) have imagined in '86 what we've got now?

-- Edited by Julia at 16:01, 2006-06-06

franna · V Deep

The U2 bunch do audio chats all the time on Yahoo.

We usually also have people at the shows with a cell/mobile phone, who will call someone at home who puts the call on speaker phone, and runs a mic from the speaker into their computer. Then, that person opens an audio chat room...and voila! Everyone gets to hear a bad audio transmission of the show, but it's still tons of fun.

I hosted the U2 broadcast from Las Vegas along with people from the US, Portugal, Belgium and elsewhere. The people in the chatroom (we had two, each room holds about 50) were from all over the world. BIG FUN.

We also occasionally play bootlegs, or just stream of consciousness "radio" broadcasts, on weekends.

One of my favs is when Lawrence, in Scotland, talks. I often have no idea what he's saying.

-- Edited by franna at 17:35, 2006-06-06

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

I've got a webcam, I think that does something like this. However, I've never hooked it up.

franna · V Deep

OK, I found another one:

Are you a Yankee or a Rebel? http://www.alphadictionary.com/articles/yankeetest.html

Somehow, inexplicably, I am: 48% Dixie. Barely in Yankeedom.

WTF????? I am a Bronx girl!!!!! Home of the Damned Yankees!!!!!! *shakes head*

Tango · In the Long Grass

40% Dixie. You are definitely a Yankee.

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

I couldn't answer all the questions, they just weren't applicable

but I got:

34% Dixie. You are definitely a Yankee.

I am most certainly not!!

roxane · She's So Modern

Scottie wrote:

Roxane, Bob is NOT religious in the slightest. He is athiest, he told me himself, as well as a few hundred other people, who were there at the time. He said that what he sees in Africa proves that there is not a God. This is a fact.

This comment only fits certain limited circumstance. Out of context it is very bad misquote of Bob who attends lots of church services and went to abclife.org church in Ammanford for years and was very pleased to be able to go to Ammanford Catholic church where he knew the Philipeno priest and their visiting humanitarian nun eg Sister Agnes. As we remember he was a close friend of Mother Theresa and they prayed together. He also prayed at the Vatican and knew the Pope very well. He had met him on many occasions to share their interest in alleviating global poverty and suffering. He would welcome Catholic Blessings etc and delight in God's work to help people. I think Bob is often taken out of context and may look as if he is criticising the Church when often he is exacerbated by hisd concern for humaniity which the Church understand and is why they don't take reports even quotes too literally and welcome his continued assistance to further joint kind deeds.

Scottie · Loudmouth

Sorry, Jules, I know we are getting off the thread here. Roxanne, Bob was asked if he believed in God. He said NO. I heard him myself, I was in the audience. it was not a quote. End of story.

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

'I wish I believed enough to pray'...

Anyway enough of that, that's personal to Bob, back to accents, please...

Julia · Tonight

Like Jules, I couldn't answer all the questions, but I got 43% Dixie. Barely in Yankeedom.

Weird though, because most of my answers were 'common throughout' or 'common in Northeast' .

These are the ones that made no sense at all and my answers:

1. How do you pronounce Aunt?

Like the word want

Like the word ant

Like the word caught

Like ain't

Like aren't

4. How do you pronounce the second syllable in pajamas?

Rhymes with jam

Rhymes with job

Either

Don't know

Rhymes with jar

7. How do you address a group of people?

You(se) guys

You all

Youse

You'uns, yins

Y'all

Just 'you'

19. What's a drive through liquor store called?

I don't go to such (none of the below)

Brew thru

Beverage barn

Party barn

drive through bottle shop

20. What's that bug that rolls into a ball when you touch it?

Cellar Bug

Pillbug

Roly-Poly

Doodle bug

Sow bug

umm, a centipede

While in a different form from Fran's quizzes, try your luck with some Oz slang:

http://www.funtrivia.com/submitquiz.cfm?quiz=77104

As would be expected I got 10/10; wonder what others might make of it

franna · V Deep

Julia, your link takes me to the main funtrivia portal site, and I don't know how to navigate from there.

And while you might not expect it, I couldn't answer all the questions in Yankee/Rebel either. When stuck, I just guessed, or went with the best approximation.

A group of people, for me, would also be addressed with a simple "you"; I have never seen a drive through liquor store in my life, and I had no idea what bug they were referring to. I don't normally touch bugs. (ewwwwwww)

Also problematic: icing/frosting (use both, maybe icing wins but only by a squeaker), a long sandwich with all the stuff on it is a hero, and I can't make sense of the way they laid out the answers for "cot" and "caught", but I know I don't pronounce them the same way. The tiny lobster business is referred to so infrequently here that it could be either crawfish or crayfish (I don't even know), I don't think we call the night before Halloween anything in particular, and I've never thrown toilet paper over anything in my life. (My friend's kids used to do that to their bathroom when they were babies and called it "aby rocka"....) (and when I was in college, someone once covered the elevator in the art department building wiith the stuff, a prank I deeply enjoyed.)

So, it's not exactly scientific for a USian either.

-- Edited by franna at 14:42, 2006-06-10

dam9191 · House on Fire

I took the Yankee test and much like the other one - it doesn't make sense to me. [Regarding the first test: I've lived in the upper Midwest all of my life (grew up 3 hours from the Canadian border) and only scored 20% total Midwestern.]

This Yankee test says: 25% Dixie. You are a Yankee Doodle Dandy.

I've never even been to Dixie...lol.

Regarding the Aussie slang, which one should we be taking?

http://www.funtrivia.com/ql.cfm?cat=4565

I do want to find out if I'm more Australian than American...

take care,

debm

Julia · Tonight

Sorry it's taken me so long to get back here ... and find I'd posted the wrong link ...

So, for anyone who finds this in their forum travels, here are 3 quizzes (including the one I mentioned above). The thing I really like about these is that they explain the answers - so if you get something wrong, you find out what the correct answer is, and why, after you've done the quiz .

Australians Sure Talk Funny

http://www.funtrivia.com/playquiz/quiz771048d6388.html

Real Australian Slang

http://www.funtrivia.com/playquiz/quiz89010a33078.html

A very good selection of Australian-isms

Tough Aussie Slang

http://www.funtrivia.com/playquiz/quiz763858c1280.html

I got 16/20: 1 incorrect, 3 couldn't answer. Is quite difficult, but "ave a go, mate".

-- Edited by Julia at 14:33, 2006-07-12

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

Heh not bad:

Australians sure talk funny

You scored: 7 / 10
Total points: 70
The average score for this quiz: 8 / 10

Now I can edit my post??? So the last quiz:

Tough Australian slang

You scored: 5 / 20
Total points: 50
The average score for this quiz: 13 / 20

That one was tough... I just guessed

-- Edited by Jules at 19:03, 2006-07-14

Jules · The biggest Geldof fan in the world, bar none!

I can't edit my post, so I'll have to do a new one:

Real Australian Slang

You scored: 8 / 10
Total points: 80
The average score for this quiz: 8 / 10

Getting better